Chapter 7 - Adam, Eve, and the Alien

What WOULD an alien think about how we live?

I've always loved this perspective, it never fails to get my head shaking, and I'm reminded of just how silly it all is. Miller makes a great point that I have also been considering lately. What is the result when we base our sense of joy on comparisons with others, and if it is so simple to refute, then why do we always seem to end up there. He tells of middle school hierarchies and explains it really well, 

but just listen to almost any casual conversation and you'll hear it.

I like how he puts it on p.95: 

“It is as though the voice God used to have has been taken up by less credible voices.”

So why do we do what we do. Sure we’re great at rationalizing just about any comparison, but in God’s eyes, does it matter?

“I was just another stupid child in the flow, you know; I didn’t know any of these things. I didn’t know it didn’t matter what a person looked like, how much money they made or whether or not they were cool. I didn’t know that cool was just a myth and that one person was just as beautiful and meaningful as another.” (p. 104)

Leave a comment, and bring your story Thursday morning!

Chapter 6 - Children of Chernobyl

Chapter 5 - Naked

I didn't get a post from Rubena yet, but Larry had some fun thoughts to share on the chapter.

1. It’s not about getting naked.
   
2. Job 1:21 Naked I came into this world and naked shall I depart.
   
3. It is about recognizing our “transparency” in God’s eyes. Naked is a metaphor.
   
4. Mark Twain wrote, “Clothes make the man, naked people have little influence on society.” He was rephrasing an old adage about dressing appropriately.
   
5. The creation account, which Miller believes was written by Moses (although Moses could not have been an eye witness and so we believe the writer was inspired by The Creator God) can be read metaphorically. Humans were created, they lived in “transparent” relationship with the Creator. Humans chose to disobey their creator and the result was “sin.” Humans try to hide in the bushes and behind sanctimonious garments. God easily sees through us. 
   
6. We now live in tension between God’s grace and God’s judgment. We spend our entire lives trying to “recreate the Paradise Garden.” We finally admit failure and open ourselves to God’s forgiveness provided in Christ’s sacrifice.
7. Soon we will come “transparently” before our Creator. (Although he promises us new bodies and robes once we get there!)
   

Chapter 4 - Free Verse

Here are some thoughts on Miller Chapt. IV for our discussion this Thursday, brought to us by Larry W.

Miller likes to carry beautiful truths in “earthen vessels.” He uses earthy expressions like guts, back in the day, makes references to Dungeons and Dragons, suggests that John the Evangelist was married and had daughters, he calls the Song of Solomon a musical, and he makes certain that we know he likes to chew tobacco (not just any brand but Long-cut Wintergreen Skoal). Well, that’s about as earthy as the daily newspaper, except newspapers don’t let journalists write slang unless it is a quote.
So what is the truth Miller is putting in these clay pots. He calls his chapter “Free Verse” and he wants us to know that the Bible is not a bunch of lists, rather it is mostly poetry.
p. 55 “I had grown up thinking of my faith in a rather systematic fashion....which is frustrating because I never, ever thought you could diagram truth....I felt that truth was something living, complex, very large and dynamic and animated. Simple words, lists, or formulas could never describe truth or explain the complex nature of our reality.”
This seems to be Millers theme throughout the book, and in this chapter he wants us to think of poetry, especially, free verse, as the best way to deal with faith.
He praises St. Paul for being smart, and he suggests that Paul (p.50) “doesn’t seem like the type to judge people...” He admires John the Evangelist because he (p. 51) “was always taking the camera to the outcasts, into the margins, showing how Jesus didn’t demonstrate any favoritism.” He rhapsodizes about Moses (because he took a class in Moses) and suggests that Moses wrote the book of Job and the first five books of the Bible. He loves the poetic passages found in the books of Moses. He overlooks that fact that Moses wrote the first list of 10 and the very "listy" book of Levitiicus.
It is curious that the only poem he quotes in this “Free Verse” chapter is in iambic rhythm with ABAB rhyme scheme; a highly formulaic structure. Perhaps I am not catching the subtlety of his purpose. Is he against “formulas” or is he against meaningless and thoughtless formulas? The truly great poets can write in highly structured forms and say deeply meaningful truths. Even the Psalms are highly structured (parallelism, rhythmic patterns, and acrostics.)
Emerson, the 19th century transcendentalist philosopher says, “the man is only half himself, the other half is his poet.” Sometimes poets say what we feel but can not articulate. (this is my interjection, not Millers)
Miller, (p. 59) “Perhaps if we stop reducing the text to formulas for personal growth, we can read it as stories of imperfect humans having relations with a perfect God and come to understand the obvious message He is communicating to mankind.“

Chapter 3 - Feet of Trees

A brief review and some thoughts on chapter 3.
“All the complexity about life was begging for an explanation.” This is what Miller says is what brought him back to God. He left room for a “big God”. One that could make sense of things, one who understood the complexities and mysteries we cannot fathom. He also realizes a God this big can “stir a certain fright”.

What does Miller’s statement “God is so incredibly other.” mean to you?
Also, Is it possible for Christian leadership to be as wrong about God as Shirley MacLaine’s character in Out on a Limb?

Miller describes an eerie feeling, following his telling God He didn’t exist. Life suddenly felt very temporary, “kept up by breaths and spread atop time”. He realizes that fearing death pits you against creation. And when he expected to experience a sense of freedom, he actually felt very removed from God’s protection.

He also realizes that he has a need for others to define his identity. He memorizes poetry to sound smart, and thus gain the respect and admiration of others.
Can any of us relate to this? What have you done, learned, or tried, with the sole intent of gaining someone else’s admiration?
Next, he puts it together that “I was very concerned with getting other people to say I was good or valuable or important because the thing that was supposed to make me feel this way was gone”.

and “The God of the Bible seemed to be brokenhearted over the separation in our relationship and downright obsessed with mending the tear.”

When it comes to relationships, is there usually something behind the story that’s presented on the surface?

Did this chapter bring up any thoughts about how you think about or talk to God? How you see Him in your life?

Meeting, Week two

We got together Thursday in the Dream Room to share what we each got out of reading the first two chapters. It was great to see new faces and hear the different ways the group related to the book (and Donald Miller’s writing style).
James started us of with a prayer and a the first twelve verses from Proverbs, which I though dovetail beautifully with the content of the first two chapters.

Proverbs 3 (from the Message)
Don't Assume You Know It All
Good friend, don't forget all I've taught you; take to heart my commands.
They'll help you live a long, long time,
   a long life lived full and well.
Don't lose your grip on Love and Loyalty.
   Tie them around your neck; carve their initials on your heart.
Earn a reputation for living well
   in God's eyes and the eyes of the people.

Trust God from the bottom of your heart;
   don't try to figure out everything on your own.
Listen for God's voice in everything you do, everywhere you go;
   he's the one who will keep you on track.
Don't assume that you know it all.
   Run to God! Run from evil!
Your body will glow with health,
   your very bones will vibrate with life!
Honor God with everything you own;
   give him the first and the best.
Your barns will burst,
   your wine vats will brim over.
But don't, dear friend, resent God's discipline;
   don't sulk under his loving correction.
It's the child he loves that God corrects;
   a father's delight is behind all this.

Please continue to check back for updates and PLEASE add your comments to the discussions each chapter can open up.
Thanks Tim, for updating the NFC blog with a post about the study!

Chapter 1 - Fine Wine

Here are Alan’s “Observations and not too deep thoughts” on Chapter 1, Fine Wine:

A. Writers' Seminar - Have you ever found yourself in a situation, ie, around proper and nice Christians that seemed to have it all together, but you just didn't seem to fit in?

B. Formulas - pg 9 "..when God had the Bible put together, He hid a lot of the ancient wisdom so, basically, you have to read into things and even kind of make up things to get a formula out of it."
WHAT IS DM GETTING AT? IS HE BEING HYPER-CRITICAL OF SOMETHING THAT JUST DIDN'T WORK FOR HIM? OR IS THERE DANGER IN TRYING TO FIT GOD INTO A FORMULA, A SERIES OF STEPS, A CREED?

C. Fine Wine - "Reality is like fine wine. It will not appeal to children."
DM says he has learned to appreciate life itself, as it is, without the false hope that formulas offer. Have Christians ever offered "false hope" - a version of God that actually doesn't exist?

D. pg 14 -last paragraph that Rubena read last week: I find these thoughts exciting and probably the non-formula God that DM is trying to point us to.

See you Thursday,
Alan


Thanks for the outline, Alan!
This ought to get us off to a great start.
(How much time do we have ?)

Chapter 2 - Impostors

Earlier today, Andi sent out a great outline of chapter 2 for Thursday’s discussion.
Here it is,in case you missed it:

Chapter 2: “Impostors”
1.Relationships
a fear of intimacy
"Makes me wonder if God created us in His image or if we created Him in ours?"

2. God is like Santa
What does believing in something do to someone?
(example: when kids believe in santa, then they find out he's not real - what does that do to them?)

3. Why do you think Miller wanted to tell God that He didn't exist?
One thought would be, santa failed him. So Miller thought he would reject God before God could reject him.
See you all on Thursday,
~andi~

Thanks Andi!

Some general guidelines…

NFC Discussion Group—Spring 2008
Donald Miller, Searching for God Knows What

• read – this is a reading and discussion group

• listen – although this is also a discussion group, come first to listen

• discuss – feel free to engage in conversation; and let’s try to stay on track!

• humility – you do not know all there is to know about truth

• honesty – feel free to agree, disagree, put yourself “out there”, question assumptions, ask a risky question or challenge something you might feel is ‘sacred’

• graciousness – when listening to others or passionate about something that fires you up, be sensitive to others. If an opinion is shared that isn’t yours feel free to disagree, but please do so with grace.

• time – some have more of it on Thursday mornings than others, but we need to stick to a schedule: 7:30 – 8:15 a.m.

A few generic questions for each chapter as food for thought. Do NOT feel like you have to answer them. You can answer one, all, or none of them. They are just there to help get you thinking.
1. What did you think about this chapter? Was there anything that stood out for you? Made you wonder?
2. Feel free to share anything which you agree with or disagree with.
3. Do you have any personal examples? Did you find anything which you can apply to yourself and/or your life experiences?
4. Did this chapter bring up any questions?

• How much will we read – 1 chapter / week? YES, usually 1 chapter/week. Sometimes 2.

• Should 1 person provide an email ‘appetizer’ a couple of days ahead of the meeting to summarize the chapter, pull out a quote or two, and perhaps craft a specific question to get us going beyond the generic ones above? YES, we will self-assign people for this

• If we get too big for Starbucks, then what?

(We may already be there, see previous post!)

Location Change!

James sent out an email today with the following important updates:

We have picked up some new groups members. Great!
However, because we have grown, James doesn’t believe Starbucks will be an adequate venue. So, this Thursday we will be at Whispering Woods, in the 'Dream Room'.
Whispering Woods is located just south from the church on Fresno Street, between Shaw and Barstow (on the West side  of the road). The driveways are marked by number. Go in driveway #4.
Halfway in you will see the mailboxes. The Dream Room is right beside that. You can park in any uncovered spot. We will meet there at 7:30 a.m. You will have to bring your own coffee or beverage of choice. We will evaluate location, beverages, etc., when we gather on Thursday.

We are reading chapters 1 and 2 for this week. If you don’t have the book and need the material, James can email it to you as a .pdf.

Has anyone looked into the study guide for the book at Donald Miller's site? You can access it as a pdf here.

Check out his main site fo more interesting stuff too.  

Welcome to Page One

Hello, and welcome to the first blog post for the new NFC reading group.

Pastor James and Randy will be leading a discussion of Donald Miller’s book, Searching for God Knows What.

The Group will be meeting Thursday mornings, at 7:30.

We began this Thursday, February 7, and got to know each other and set up some guidelines for the discussion.

We are to read chapters 1 & 2 for next Thursday. See James if you’re interested in getting a copy of the first chapter.
Alan will be doing a brief review and commentary on chapter 1, and Andi will be for doing a brief review and commentary on chapter 2.
These should arrive in your email before the next meeting. I will also try to post them here for those that might not be on the email list.
We will meet at Starbucks again (Shaw & 41) and see how it goes.


If you can’t make it in person, you can still participate by reading along and commenting on the posts that will be here for each chapter.
Check back here for more! 

So again, welcome, and I hope this forum helps to get some discussion going.